just wondering where our forum members stand on this intense battle of defining our light and heat giving friend, the sun that is being fought by scientists on one side and vedic repeaters on the other

i forgot what mountain it is

I agree.

It depends.

It must be both depending upon the depth of perception of the viewer.

QUOTE (dayalu @ Feb 13 2007, 11:49 AM)

QUOTE (babu @ Feb 12 2007, 10:28 PM)

just wondering where our forum members stand on this intense battle of defining our light and heat giving friend, the sun that is being fought by scientists on one side and vedic repeaters on the other

i forgot what mountain it is

It must be both depending upon the depth of perception of the viewer.

How does it look like from your perception?

My direct perception is too limited to make a defining judgement. What you say?

Bhagavatam describes a lot of things not in terms of technical correctness but in terms of connection to Krishna - both real and merely implied. Other Vedic scriptures may describe the same things quite differently - a classic example is Rahu and Ketu, described in several astrological shastras quite technically as specific intersections of Earth and Moon orbital planes - while Bhagavatam merely relates Rahu and Ketu to Lord Vishnu's pastimes. Devotees are not usually interested in minute technical details of the cosmic manifestation thus they describe reality in terms of its connection with Lord's pastimes.

As to the Sun. Perhaps there are other ways to describe the Sun as well. Some Vedic explanations speak of the "real" Sun and the Sun we see on this plane of existence. The "real" Sun is supposed to exist on a higher level of being, and the Sun visible to us is like a peephole to the "real" Sun. The same with the Moon.

It may be easy for some to dismiss such concepts as fantasy, yet I find these ideas to be fascinating and instinctively believe them to be true. The understanding of the Vedic concept of the Universe starts with understanding of the concept of multidimensional and non-linear space - the perception of that space (abhvam, or the frightening abyss) is actually one of the important elements of mystic yoga.

QUOTE (dayalu @ Feb 13 2007, 12:29 PM)

QUOTE (zanardi @ Feb 13 2007, 06:11 AM)

QUOTE (dayalu @ Feb 13 2007, 11:49 AM)

QUOTE (babu @ Feb 12 2007, 10:28 PM)

just wondering where our forum members stand on this intense battle of defining our light and heat giving friend, the sun that is being fought by scientists on one side and vedic repeaters on the other

i forgot what mountain it is

It must be both depending upon the depth of perception of the viewer.

How does it look like from your perception?

My direct perception is too limited to make a defining judgement. What you say?

I say the same.

Yes, where's the 'both' option?
People have always described the cosmos in terms of myth and allegory - it has more beauty and intensity than a mere physical explanation and communicates with the poet in man.

The Sun is bright, but not at night

what do adult daipers have to do with this?

the Sun can purify even urine Prabhupada said

you did not have "a boat carrying the falcon-headed king of the gods".... EVERYBODY knows the sun is the Barque of Ra. Silly Babu.

stool it purifies, urine is already pure

you want some of the purity right from the tap?

nope, mine was a wheel on chariot... to each his own

Babu the bull.

This is very interesting, Kulapavana, do you know which Vedic texts perhaps? The whole aspect of astronomy in mythology is fascinating: almost everyone who is somebody in Hindu, Greek or even Polynesian mythology seems to be a star or planet.
7 rishi's = Big Dipper,
gopi's = incarnations of rishi's
Brihaspati = Jupiter
Skanda = Mars
Shiva = Sirius
etc., etc., etc., etc., the list is endless.

Are the planets and stars physical expansions or vehicles (bodies) of Higher Beings or only peepholes, or is that the same thing in different words?

:note: kulapavana blooped into the spiritual world and is no longer a member of this forum... we do wish he would return

Yeah, i miss Kulapavana bad, i didn't get to say.............................................................................
..................Click to view attachment
come back please kula prabhu

i will answer the devotee understanding since kula has left

the sun is a golden wheel on the chariot of vivaswan as it circles mount meru. occasionally the chariot wheel or sun hits a pothole or bump in its path which we know as a solar flare

The sun's not yellow, it's a chicken.

Bob Dylan

My alternative viewpoint:
The Sun, planets and stars are the bodies of jiva souls, called ksetra (field of action, this body) in the Gita. These great bodies act automatically as ours do. We and they have freedom of action only within our particular ksetra. The senses of one type of ksetra are limited within that particular ksetra and will not be able to perceive the being inhabiting a ksetra beyond or outside the particular range of perception, even though those beings called ‘devas’ are naturally situated as the source of our all senses and their perceptions. They always exist in every time and place and are called differently in all cultures and times. Only movement, apparently without a person doing the moving (as in wind, or infinite subtle material actions) would be perceptible within our direct range. Only consciousness can move matter, and only conscious bodies produce chemicals, radiations, movement, ect. “This Divine energy of Mine” as in Gita.

My brains are getting softer and softer, I think, coz I have a hard time understanding you. Are you saying that ksetra is the same as a body (and according to the Gita you can)?
What is then the difference between what I said and what you say, viz. that planets and stars are the bodies of Higher Beings?

mr. softie, you said in your post something about (parrotphrase)... "are the planets and stars bodies of higher being or peepholes?" and so dayalu's answer on the authority of his master's purport of the gita is that they are the body and not peepholes although he didn't go as far to say as such

"power to the peephole, power to the peephole right on" john lennon

Thank you

Hardly any difference but yes, ksetra is the body, as in Prabhupada's translation of Gita, a different (in words) translation (Sagar) of BR Sridhara's bengali Gita may shed a different light on the universal application. A planet as a body is not said here but is the inescapable conclusion. This is a reminder only:
13.1
Arjuna said: O Kesava, I would like to know the principles of the predominated,
the predominator, the sphere of action, the knower of that sphere, knowledge,
and the knowable.
13.2
The Supreme Lord said: O Arjuna, this (gross and subtle or physical and mental) body is known as the sphere of action, or ksetra. The conscious entity (the soul) who experiences the existence of this body is described by seers of the truth as the knower of the sphere of action, or ksetra-jna.
13.3
O Bharata, you should also know Me as the knower of all spheres of action (as the Supersoul situated within the heart of all living beings). Such fundamental and essential knowledge of the sphere of action and the knowers of that sphere (knowledge of the mundane, the soul, and the Supersoul) is considered by Me to be actual knowledge.
13.4
Now hear from Me a summary of the substance and nature of this sphere of action, and in which way it is produced. Also hear of the fundamental form and potency of the knower of the sphere of action.
13.5
That fundamental principle of the sphere of action and its knower has been variously described in many, many ways by the Rishis, the different Vedic aphorisms, as well as the aphorisms of the Vedanta-sutra scripture, which is replete with sound logic and irrefutable conclusions.
13.6-7
The five major elements (earth, water, fire, air, and ether), the personality component of ego, the element of intellect, the primordial element of material nature, the five perceptual senses (eye, tongue, tactile sense, nose, and ear), the five senses of action (voice, hands, legs, anus, and genital), the internal sense (mind), the five acceptable objects of the senses (form, taste, touch, smell, and sound), desire, hatred, happiness, unhappiness, the body, the perceptual faculty of the mind, patience, and the six material transformations of birth, sustenance, growth, maturity, decline, and destruction - summarily, all these are known as ksetra, the sphere of action.
(I know I still didn't work the quote thing right)

i see softy's peephole angle cuz surya has both his body as the sun but he is active as well in his human similar form such as out propagating with kunti

so what does surya (although we know as a vaisnava, he knows he's not the body) consider his primary body, his human similar body or his body as the shiny orb we see in the sky? if he considers his human similar body to be his principle body, then would the sun be a peephole?

could this be where john lennon distanced himself from a.c. swami cuz it seems he bought into the peephole theory of the cosmos... aka wormhole?

Human similar body as principle body. We see (become aware of) our self because of the Sun, the Light, the seeing Eye of Godhead. so we can see, be. If Sun is only an object we would be like moths approaching, burnt crispy, but as person, Vivisvan, it's coolness would allow entrance (i.e. wormhole).

so when the sun or surya became a paedophile (by current western definitions, surya would probably have done jail time and then be put on a sex offenders watch list for such activity) and fathered a child with the underage kunti, was surya able to bi-locate and both exist as a human similar form
and the ball of fire (fission fusion of helium and hydrogen atoms) in the sky or did the sky go black while surya got busy?



ditto, agree but i feel this is a poetic affirmation of faith and not a constructural argument as you suggest



or as in kunti's case... she was the one who was entered and not burnt like a moth... burnt crispy... maybe it started out as coolness but things must of got a little heated

i would imagine though if the sun was going to be doing jail time for a sex offense, the scientific community would recomend that such an action would be at the peril of all life on earth and the ensuing deep chill... perhaps a few moments of jail time now and then to off-set global warming

All this talk about soft brains makes me flash back to my son's recovery from head injury, when a part of his skull was missing and he had to wear a helmet all the time to protect his own soft brain.

When I think of the sun, however, I can only think, "Goodness gracious great ball of fire!"

QUOTE (Tapati @ Feb 27 2007, 09:59 PM)

All this talk about soft brains makes me flash back to my son's recovery from head injury, when a part of his skull was missing and he had to wear a helmet all the time to protect his own soft brain. 

When I think of the sun, however, I can only think, "Goodness gracious great ball of fire!"

Your talk about helmets reminds me of how people joke about Swedes wearing a helmet what ever they are doing. As far as the sun goes and our stand in this issue, I wish it would come very soon closer to planet earth again. Me not like cold and dark!

NO NO NO. It is only an illusion appearing to those who are not able to see the reality of the apparent fiery heat being a barrier to keep the materialists away.

That's why a realized person is able to spend unlimited time basking in the rays of our brother sun totally naked.

Click to view attachmentfalse sun

Click to view attachmentActual sun.

i actually feel uncomfortable with the sun, dislike sunny days due to the history of the sun as a paedophile... give me cloudy days and rain

another thing i find questionable about the sun's behavior and typical of tapati's ex and so many other men is when he was called onto the scene by kunti's utterance of the mantra given to her by vasishta, he says "i'm here and so we might as well have some good come out of it and so let's make a baby" which is just so typical of a male idea of making a baby with a woman is such a great boon to the world and then they just take off without concern for the financial support or wellbeing of the child

folks, i wish you all a cloudy rainy day

The sun? I think... is basically gone!