why humanities should be abolished, an essay (rough draft) for FSU pres Options

[angrezi]

rough draft to FSU pres, board of Regents and Jeb Bush

The academic function of a university ideally does something useful. I see no use for the humanities, classics, fine arts or even religion depatments. This is my opinion. But in actuality their funding should be cut by 75%. These programs foster an elitist culture of snobbery, cronyism, and the biggest egos known to mankind, in spite of their lack of applicability to the modern world in which we live. They exist for their own self-perpetuation and attract many younger people with no knowledge of life to pursue a similar parasitic existence draining taxpayer funds with lavish salaries and tuition waivers, from more useful programs in medicine, chemestry, and other sciences. While China, Korea, and India send hundreds of thousands of strudents to American engineering schools, American students are sitting in classes like "Homosexuality in in the Greek Tradgedy".

What king commissioned a chola dynasty Siva sculpture, or the number of optative verbs in classical Greek, have absolutely no practical use in life. The students in these 'humanities' classes are given a plethora of facts and dates to memorize, most of which will be quickly forgotten by the next semester, and totally forgotten by the time they enter a career that will (unless they want to be parasitic professors themselves) certainly have nothing at all to do with these courses.
Its time the sham is revealed and institutions of higher learning realize we are no longer in the 19th century. There are no relevent texts left to be translated. No major artistic discoveries to uncover, the Renaissance has been fully documented etc.

Its time we get real and expose this scam for what it is: an anachronistic elitist club of people who can't do anything useful with their lives, and live at the expense of suffering working class people of the state of Florida who could benefit from the funds channeled to these expendable areas. This is why I, and others like me will form the Trotsky beer club of Florida State, and will actively seek the (legal) elimination of such bougeois deadbeats from the state coffers.

[angrezi]

I would like comments and suggestions on this , as it is likely to be sent (or hand delivered) after a few beers and a few weeks. Spelling help, additional points, etc? I think I need to develop the argument more.

[Preyobrazhenya]

He who has not learned from the past is condemned to repeat it in the future...

Our world is screwed up precicely because we don't have the critical thinking skills that are learned in a rigorous classical education. Greek verbs exercise the mind. It is not nearly as pointless as you think. Man is more than a mechanical robot. Arts and humanities keep us human. It is precicely the lack of such educated people that has given us souless leadership and narrow vision. The modern way is "how profitable is it?"

I don't think your letter is necessary. The Bush clan never cared too much for critical thinking - it won't take Jeb much to cut it out of the FSU system even without your letter.

[angrezi]

I dont think classics should be eliminated completely just to put it in its proper place -way down there. I wasnt lumping in modern history courses ansd social sciences to my tirade, which i think are important for the reasons you mentioned. there are more practical ways to excercize the mind than classical greek, like modern chinese


i edited this and cut out a chunk on accident and will leave it like this becasue I dont remember what was there exactly


(heres the chunk ): are you by any chance a grad student or professor?

This post has been edited by angrezi: Mar 15 2006, 06:06 PM

[angrezi]

He who has not learned from the past is condemned to repeat it in the future...

Our world is screwed up precicely because we don't have the critical thinking skills that are learned in a rigorous classical education.

  Man is more than a mechanical robot.  Arts and humanities keep us human.   

the classical world was pretty screwed up too. slavery, class oppression, military occupations, and squashing of other cultures , etc etc etc

I agree about art but you dont need to academia appreciate it.

[Preyobrazhenya]

are you by any chance a grad student or professor?

B.A. Classics - U of Mass.
M.Div. (professional doctorate) - Harvard University

Profession after graduation: IT professional - software/application/web programming that required knowledge of Byzantine Greek and Church Slavonic. Funding cut last summer... Currently a part time church worker, & hopefully a future nun. Involved with a community that may start a theological school - so I could be a future professor... I've planted my feet back in Massachusetts after 2-3 years of back and forth between here and Quebec.

The only Math and Science courses I took were 2 semesters of Calculus and 1 semester each on Evolution, psychopharmacology and a course on brain chemistry. Not one IT course! Actually, I would have considered pre-med studies as an undergrad, but because all the science classes required labs and whatnot, which were only offered at evening hours. I couldn't take them because of being a single parent with no family around to help watch my son. Medical research interests me.

I'd have the Ph.D. and be a professor too if I had had the money when I finished the M.Div.. About 2 years ago a job opened up in my specialty and even though I was probably the best person for the job, I lacked the Ph.D. required.

There is a well funded Byzantine Studies program at Harvard that I am well qualified for and interested in, but I have had memory problems for the past 2 years and don't feel up to going back to school. My previous strong analytical skills are shot as well. Many around me think that the memory problem is tied to the stress of my previous living in 2 places - too much re-adjustment required on a frequent basis. I'm staying put for now so if I ever get my memory and intellect back, I will apply to the program.

[angrezi]

oh now i see...I meant nothing personal preyo...just writing some obs and opinions of the world... I dont useually express my opinions, real or exagerrated, because there are different sides to everything as you mention

I'm sure youd be a much better prof than the goofs running around here.

btw, my socialist beer club will also call for the removal of Bush in all of his manefestations at the state and national levels

[0Oneiros0]

Angrezi, have you read J. M. Coetzee's Elizabeth Costello? You would find it interesting.

[angrezi]

No. I dont have time to read anything that I actually want to unfortunately, could you give me a brief synopsis?

[angrezi]

I found one:

"In Elizabeth Costello: Eight Lessons (2003) Coetzee invented his female alter ego, a famous writer, who travels all over the world and gives speeches and academic lectures. In the United States she discusses and analyzes Kafka's monkey story 'A Report to the Academy' (lesson 1), in England at the fictional Appleton College she drew a parallel between gas chambers and the breeding of animals for slaughter (lesson 3), and in Amsterdam her subject is the problem of evil (lesson 6). As a material Coetzee used his own academic lectures, but at the same time he strips bare Costello's intellectual lifestyle - although her arguments are always fresh and seductive, the result of all her theoretizing is that she starts resemble more and more the copy of Kafka's primate, whose basic predicletions and moral ideas are contrary to the real world."

[0Oneiros0]

From http://www.complete-review.com/reviews/coetzeej/elizacos.htm:

Another chapter considers: 'The Humanities in Africa' (though, in fact, it addresses the humanities per se), as Elizabeth Costello goes to South Africa to see her sister, Blanche (or Sister Bridget, as she is now known as), receive an honorary degree for her work, most recently as administrator of a local hospital. It is Blanche's acceptance speech that is the centrepiece here. As Sister Bridget she says she does not belong among these humanities scholars: "The message I bring is that you lost your way long ago, perhaps as long as five centuries ago." Humanities are now "truly on their deathbed", brought there by the very "monster of reason" they unleashed. Later, Blanche also tells her sister that:

You backed a loser, my dear. If you had put your money on a different Greek you might still have stood a chance. Orpheus instead of Apollo. The ecstatic instead of the rational.

It's among the more interesting and polarised debates in the book; it is also one of the episodes that, in its layering of narratives, suggests that these complexities are as not as easily reduced to black or white as Blanche insists.

[Preyobrazhenya]

oh now  i see...I meant nothing personal preyo...just writing some obs and opinions of the world... I dont useually express my opinions, real or exagerrated, because there are different sides to everything as you mention

I'm sure youd be a much better prof than the goofs running around here.

btw, my  socialist beer club will also call for the removal of Bush in all of his manefestations at the state  and national levels

Truth to tell, I probably understand what you are saying about humanities - courses that are "touchy-feeley" and/or PC. We had some real whoppers at Harvard, let me tell you! We called such courses "gut" or "gutter" courses - undergrads took them just to fill time and get an easy grade. Very little learning actually occurred. I tried to avoid these like the plague.

p.s. Maybe Florida can cut the $$ from these kinds of courses and give it to health care. Florida has a really sucky Medicare program, from what I know. Seems to me like Tallahassee (sp??) wants the sick and old to simply die (unless they can get a Terry Schiavo incident out of it).

[Preyobrazhenya]

the classical world was pretty screwed up too. slavery, class oppression, military occupations,  and squashing of other cultures , etc etc etc

This is just the point. They did have the same screw ups and flaws and atrocities, and problems, etc. that exist today. Humanity has changed quite little in retrospect. Maybe we can learn from their mistakes. We can also learn from the societies that did work - especially Byzantium, with its socialist economy that still provided prosperity. Lasted for 1,000 years and was said to be the most propserous society ever.

[0Oneiros0]

We can also learn from the societies that did work - especially Byzantium, with its socialist economy that still provided prosperity.  Lasted for 1,000 years and was said to be the most propserous society ever.

The Byzantine Empire is very interesting. However, there is a reason that the OED's definition of Byzantine includes the following: "Belonging to Byzantium or Constantinople; also, reminiscent of the manner, style, or spirit of Byzantine politics. Hence, intricate, complicated; inflexible, rigid, unyielding."

[angrezi]

Yes, Preyo health care sucks in FL. Its a great place to live if youre making .5 mil. The football coach here makes over $2 mil. so I guess I shouldnt bitch about humanities.

[evakurvan]

We can also learn from the societies that did work - especially Byzantium, with its socialist economy that still provided prosperity. Lasted for 1,000 years and was said to be the most propserous society ever.

Adapted from Sailing To Byzantium
by W.B. Yeats


That is no country for old men. The young
In one another's arms, birds in the trees--
Fish, flesh, or fowl, commend all summer long
Whatever is begotten, born, and dies.
Caught in that sensual music all neglect

An aged man is but a paltry thing,
A tattered coat upon a stick, unless
Soul clap its hands and sing, and louder sing
For every tatter in its mortal dress.
And therefore I have sailed the seas and come
To the holy city of Byzantium.

O sages standing in God's holy fire
As in the gold mosaic of a wall,
Come from the holy fire, perne in a gyre,
And be the singing-masters of my soul.
Consume my heart away; sick with desire
And fastened to a dying animal
It knows not what it is; and gather me
Into the artifice of eternity.

[Preyobrazhenya]

We can also learn from the societies that did work - especially Byzantium, with its socialist economy that still provided prosperity.  Lasted for 1,000 years and was said to be the most propserous society ever.

The Byzantine Empire is very interesting. However, there is a reason that the OED's definition of Byzantine includes the following: "Belonging to Byzantium or Constantinople; also, reminiscent of the manner, style, or spirit of Byzantine politics. Hence, intricate, complicated; inflexible, rigid, unyielding."

The emperors were often wicked, frequently heretics, and there certainly was a lot of intrigue - BUT for the ordinary people, life was generally good. This part is often overlooked.

Also the English sense of the word is likely a Western perspective that may resent that Constantinople refused to capitulate to the West and also enjoyed a golden age while the West was riding out the Dark Ages.

I'm sure Tapati could chime in about how certain terms that should not be pejoritive have ended up that way over time.

[Ayyapan]

"Consume my heart away; sick with desire
And fastened to a dying animal
It knows not what it is; and gather me
Into the artifice of eternity."

This was very beautifully said, I think.

As for education... I think mathematics is most important. Maths and athletics. Strong intellect, healthy body. The rest will follow...

Of course, the humanities are enriching - if you study them with a strong mind, capable of analythical thinking (maths is basic!),

What I tend to think is over-stressed are chemistry, technology and such. For those that are interested - yes, but not for everyone. In Sweden every kid has to learn a lot of chemistry; Just jam it into the head! Whereas maths is highly disregarded, as are the humanities.

I think though a good program would be to first work with the body - the study and practice of athletics, make it fit - and then (as the body's energies are expanded the mind becomes more focused) study maths. Later, when the mind is strong and sound (due to developed analythical thinking), study humanities, first and foremost. And then, lastly, different alternatives could be there... either a deeper dive into maths or some of the humanities - or perhaps technology or chemistry etc (for those who crave it!).

But to have a lot of people around with unhealthy bodies and minds, whose minds cannot think analythically, who has not developed their appriciation for the humanities - but who knows quite some about technology or chemistry, I think is only a burden, and a danger.

[Preyobrazhenya]

"Consume my heart away; sick with desire
And fastened to a dying animal
It knows not what it is; and gather me
Into the artifice of eternity."

This was very beautifully said, I think.

As for education... I think mathematics is most important. Maths and athletics. Strong intellect, healthy body. The rest will follow...

I think though a good program would be to first work with the body - the study and practice of athletics, make it fit - and then (as the body's energies are expanded the mind becomes more focused) study maths. Later, when the mind is strong and sound (due to developed analythical thinking), study humanities, first and foremost. And then, lastly, different alternatives could be there... either a deeper dive into maths or some of the humanities - or perhaps technology or chemistry etc (for those who crave it!).

But to have a lot of people around with unhealthy bodies and minds, whose minds cannot think analythically, who has not developed their appriciation for the humanities - but who knows quite some about technology or chemistry, I think is only a burden, and a danger.

Add classical studies to your suggestion and you have a perfect curriculum, IMHO. About athletics, at least here in the USA there needs to be a different approach because the approach that is used here discourages those who are not competitive to be active. To me the word "athletic" or "sports" means something pejorative - only because of my negative physical education experiences. It should not be this way because physical education IS very important.

All pre-High School athletics here in the USA are not so much oriented to the building of physical strength and endurance, but rather how to play team/competitive games. For someone like myself, who is not really much into these games and is also rather uncoordinated so plays very poorly, this does not at all encourage physical activity. On the contrary, it builds up resentment and dislike of anything physical or athletic.

In retrospect, it would have been far better for there to be a "2 stream" approach to physical education. For those who like team sports, they could have that. But for those who do not, they could develop positive body images and love of activity by participating in aerobic and body building activities that are non-competitive.

Very occasionally, we would have dance modules in physical education. How I loved these because I did enjoy the physical motion and was free from the stress of not being able to contribute to the team's strength. US physical education needs to have more swimming and skating as well. Give us treadmills, stairmasters and other aerobic equipment. Imagine what this could do for the esteem of a "fatty patty!"

Let the team sports happen at recess for those who like it. In the schools I attended, we were also forced to play team sports at recess whether we liked them or not. For those of us who were not got at these sports, recess was not a relief, but torture and humiliation. Again - this is something that discourages activity in some of us.

Popularity in the USA in grade school is very tied to the ability to play team sports. The self esteem of the poorly coordinated is very harmed because of this focus. Imagine if these non-team players felt pride in physical endurance and strength! Their well developed bodies might even become envied by the team players!

I would be interested to know what Physical Education is like in Europe. Is it all team sports or is it actual building of bodily strength and endurance? This latter is so important for a sound mind and body and really does need to be a part of any curriculum.

[Ayyapan]

Actually, when I said athletics I did not exactly mean sports. To me they are rather different... and I definately did not mean ball games and such! I always found them extremely ridiculous! Of course, as a play you may enjoy them if you like them (I don't) but to take them seriously, as they are generally taken, I find totally distasteful.

By athletics I primarily meant running - short distance and long distance, swimming, biking, throwing (discus etc), jumping - high or far... Such things. - To stretch one's own bodily limits. To fight over some ball are not athletical at all, to me - but perhaps a sport, a game and a play. And in case one likes to do it it should - most importantly - be done in a playful spirit, I think.

Nowadays I do actually play these kind of games, daily - with my dogs. I never did before, really - but with them I really like it! Because they always keep up with that playful spirit. We have a huge "tennis ball" (bigger than a foot ball), and that I will kick and dribble trying to get past them. And they will try to take it from me. And they will eventually succeed - especially Teodor is very good at breaking through my dribbling! And then I will growl, stamp the ground and make fierce attacks! And they will all bark and howl as I kick that ball hard right from Teodors mouth. And he will be very very happy, jumping enthusiastically up and down. This is fun. But it is just a play, a game - not athletics. But only for fun.

I think one should study though, seriously, how one's body funtions. What it can do. How far one can stretch one's limits. Find that which one, personally, is best at - and then develope it. Together with this one may study, theoretically, about anatomics, biology, issues of nourishment, what happens when one stretch the limits of one's muscular abilities and other essencials... And actually use this theoretical knowlegde to develope one's body and one's bodily skills nicely! This is what I mean by athletics - learn the theories behind bodily funtions and other connected fields of knowledge, and then use them to develope one's body in practice, with determination, towards a set desired goal. This is what I think is important.

Then, as that is done - one is ready to sit down, nicely, and study logic, maths, geometry etc. And work, thus, on developing also an eaqually strong analythical mind.